Who are those Guys?- Quiz!
Most of us old guys saw Butch Cassidy and the Sundance kid. A question that kept coming up as they were being chased was: “Who are those guys?” In our church I wonder “who are those guys” all the time! Anyway take the below quiz. I’m not sure the answers, but was hoping you could help me!
- Who actually are the correlation committee (their names if you know them)? Who appointed them?
- Who is the church’s Public Relations company? (I heard it was a Jewish PR firm in New York)
- When president Hinckley was interviewed by Larry King was there someone who said if we’re not happy with the interview we have the sole rights to pull it? Who worked with Pres Hinckley on what questions would be asked? (Or do you think he did it off the cuff)
- Who are those guys that made the policy to go to a straight 3 hour block? Is it done by the prophet and apostles or is their a team of researchers that correlate with them?
- Who are those guys who invest the church’s money? Who is on the committee?
- Who decides in the church to show or not show our financial statements?
- When the BYU professors (September Six) were disciplined, who initially started the ball rolling before they were brought in before their stake presidents and the high council?
- I thought I read some where that FAIR use outside staff (non-members) in their research. If so, who are these guys?
- Who appoints the director of the Ensign?
- Joseph Smith The Prophet of the Restoration: who own the LDS motion picture studio?
- Strengthening The Church Members Committee: who are these guys? (ex-CIA?) Who appointed them? Who heads it? Are they watchin’ us now?
- The conference center and the new mall, who is on the committee that has the vision for this, beside the prophet? How much did the conference center cost? (cheeky question but it would be interesting to know)
- The Pioneer memorial park is now run by an outside firm in partnership with the church and are now open Sundays they charge $8.00 to get in. (I personally think this is good.) Who appointed them? Who in the church made the decision to do this?
Who are those guys? It’s a good time to ask and find out!
Who decides that the workday is from 9 to 5, instead of 11 to 4? Who decides that the hemlines will be below the knee this year and short again next year? Who draws up the borders, controls the currency, handles all of the decisions that happen transparently around us?”
“I don’t know.”
“Ah! I’m with them. Same group, different department. Think of me as a sort of middleman, and the name is Justin. Come in, sit, sit. The tea is getting cold.”
— Sheridan and Justin in Babylon 5:”Z’ha’dum”
These are great questions James. I am sorry to say that I said “I dont know” to most of them. Quite sad really considering I have been in the church my whole life. It makes me feel like I dont really know how the church “works”.
I think these are some essential questions as they are not democratically voted upon. I am moving my banking accounts into ethical accounts and credit unions…I wonder if the church invests in War Profiteering companies, Oil companies, or any other companies which might be ethically questionable. I personally would like to see some transparency.
I know most of the leadership are ex-armed services and that Neal A Maxwell was ex-CIA and also in charge of the Church’s education committee. When I recite “non-answers” every Sunday School and when I find out the church’s policy to free thought is “You are free to think it just dont talk to other members about it”…I cant help but wonder if Neal Maxwell used some of the same methods that the CIA encourages through propaganda.
I have the answer for the 3 hour block….or atleast the answer I was told was that some Bishop in California thought “Sod this…having 2 meetings in one day…I will combine them.” And his attendance was highest in his area and so the leadership took notice of what he did and decided to change it. So it was a bottom up change. But this is what I heard and it could be wrong.
All this grim business is orchestrated by Greyface and his devotees. His minions are many. His influence is great. Fear him…
No answers to your questions, but a correction. There were only two members of the September 6 who were BYU professors.
Here’s a list of the 6:
Avraham Gileadi is the one whose name is missing there. (I’m not sure if he was officially a BYU professor, but I think he was.)
Strengthening Church Members Committee
-Several members of the Q15 and a few members of the 70. Don’t know who is on it right now
-Used to meet regularly, probably still is
-Most of the ex-CIA/FBI guys are in Church Security (a little scarier than the SCMC)
Showing financial statements
-Hasn’t been done since the 1950’s, due to the church massively overspending on building chapels & the Church Office Building and almost not making payroll. I think that was also a Q15 decision
Don’t really know much else…lol
I’m interested in the answers, but I don’t care enough to do the research myself. 🙂
Between the 1920s and early 1960s, there was an increase in printed material available to LDS Church members, much of which contained opinions or quotes of church leaders that contradicted the official positions and doctrines of the church. In addition, historical documents surfaced, were made available or printed from early members diaries which did not support the official church history.
Because of this sudden increase of information, a number of doctrines formed that deviated from standard church doctrine. For example, in the late 1950s, there was a sudden interest in the
1. Adam-God theory
2. The doctrine of Blood atonement which were popularly taught in the 19th century, but which were since repudiated.
3. Sons of Perdition may have a second chance for redemption in another life.
In the 1960s, there were many non canonical Later-day Saint perceptions rounds in local church meetings, largely due to the publication of Mormon Doctrine.
To counter this, the Correlation Committee, under the direction of the First Presidency, began to print materials and other curriculum to clarify and standardize what the church hierarchy considered to be official doctrine and history. As a result, some believe that since the 1960s the Church has “watered itself down,” removing some of the more colourful, popular, and distinctive doctrines and circumventing much of the church’s early history.
On the other hand, some members are much more comfortable with, and inspired by, a standard set of doctrines and history in which most of the inconsistencies and eccentricities have been rejected as non-canonical.
3 hour block = Correlation Committee again!!
Another result of the Correlation Committees is the three hour block program, which standardized Sunday as the official day to hold most public church meetings. Prior to the 1980s, meetings were held throughout the week. For example, in a local ward, the Relief Society may have met on Monday mornings, Primary and choir practice on Tuesdays, Young Women and Young Men on Thursdays, ward activities and events on Fridays, and service projects on Saturdays.
Because of the church’s focus on families, the Correlation Committee recommended a three-hour block of meetings on Sundays that would include a sacrament meeting, Sunday School, priesthood meetings, Relief Society and children’s classes. This would allow families to spend more time together, and for parents and children to be more involved with their communities.
I can’t even keep track of who holds what callings in my ward! The 3 hour block is a vast improvement over the split schedule for those who have to drive long distances. I know of some on 2 hour version, which sounds cool, but I wouldn’t shorten my current ward. I only want to shorten it when I’ve been in wards where teachers are boring, ill prepared, uninformed, or otherwise a waste of time.
Great post. Along that same line, who are the guys who behind the quasi-doctrinal blasts coming from the LDS Newsroom site? I’ve got a feeling they aren’t GAs(if they were, why not just say so?), which leads to the troubling notion that Church policy/doctrine is being made by faceless middle-management office workers.
Church’s Public Relations company?
In line with its recent restructuring, the church has ended a decade-long relationship with Edelman, the world’s largest independent public relations firm, with 2,500 employees in 46 offices worldwide. Edelman won some distinction in 2002 when it helped the church navigate the Winter Olympics bidding scandal in Salt Lake City.
The local account was handled by Michael Deaver, a former top aide to president Reagan. Deaver did not return phone calls. In response to a query from The Politico, Otterson wrote in an e-mail: “The church uses a number of agencies from time to time, depending on need. Indeed, it still has the option to work with Edelman. Although it’s true we have ended the formal contract, very few such contracts in that industry last so long. You shouldn’t assume that this represents any ‘change of direction’ for the church.”
Otterson, in a phone interview from the church’s Salt Lake City headquarters, said the church is interviewing other firms but declined to name them. Several Edelman staffers who would not talk on the record said the church sought to have increased autonomy in its media relations.
Avraham was a BYU professor but was not part of the six. His disciplinary council and trial occurred at a later time. He is currently a faithful member.
Conference Center Cost
“The church is currently building a $240 million assembly hall that occupies an entire city block and will provide seating for 22,000. It paid for the project in cash.”F380
I am with Ray (#6). I look forward all comments, informed or not!
The answer to all your questions is… me.
I am with Shawn Larsen (#10). I look forward to all comments, informed or not!
Actually, everything you mentioned was determined by a 6-member committee. One member each from the Trilateral Commission, Freemasons, Illuminati, Skull & Bones, and the Danites; and is chaired by the Cigarette Smoking Man.
“Actually, everything you mentioned was determined by a 6-member committee. One member each from the Trilateral Commission, Freemasons, Illuminati, Skull & Bones, and the Danites; and is chaired by the Cigarette Smoking Man.”
You mean the New World Bible Translation Committee???
Larry_co: good one!
Well, it’s a well known fact, Sonny Jim, that there’s a secret society of the five wealthiest people in the world, known as The Pentavirate, who run everything in the world, including the newspapers, and meet tri-annually at a secret country mansion in Colorado, known as… The Meadows.
“So who’s in this Pentavirate?”, you ask?
The Queen, The Vatican, The Gettys, The Rothschilds, *and* Colonel Sanders
Good Job Clay, you beat me to the punch on the ‘So I married an Axe Murderer’quote – the movie I watched the night before I went into the MTC.
I remain convinced that the Colonel(before he went tete’s up) was also behind Family Home Evening so that Families would eat his secret recipe. It is no coincidence that the first KFC was at 33rd South in Salt Lake City.
. . . the conspiracy widens . . .
Strengthening Church Members Committee (SCMC)
Is a committee of general authorities who monitor the publications of church members for possible criticism of local and general leaders of the church. If criticism is found, the committee may forward information to local church authorities, who may bring charges of apostasy, which can result in excommunication.
The committee was formed sometime during the administration of church President Ezra Taft Benson (Time 1994), soon after Benson became president in 1985 (Quinn). The existence of the committee became known in 1991, when a 1990 church memo from general authority Glenn L. Pace referencing the committee was published by an anti-Mormon ministry. The committee was one of the subjects discussed in the 1992 Sunstone Symposium in talks by Lavina Fielding Anderson and Eugene England (then a BYU professor) on August 6, 1992. Soon thereafter, the Salt Lake Tribune published news stories on the subject (Tribune, August 8, 1992 and August 15, 1992). In response, the LDS Church spokesman Don LeFevre acknowledged the existence of the committee (St. Petersburg 1992). LeFevre said that the committee “receives complaints from church members about other members who have made statements that ‘conceivably could do harm to the church'”, then the committee will “pass the information along to the person’s ecclesiastical leader.” According to LeFevre, however, “the committee neither makes judgments nor imposes penalties.” Discipline is “entirely up to the discretion of the local leaders.” (St. Petersburg 1992)
The existence of the committee became national news. Speaking to the New York Times, LeFevre stated that the committee “provides local church leadership with information designed to help them counsel with members who, however well-meaning, may hinder the progress of the church through public criticism.” (Times 1992). He denied that such referrals were intended to intimidate scholars. The First Presidency then issued a statement on August 22, 1992 defended the committee based on a 1839 letter to Joseph Smith, Jr. while he was in prison after a period of intense persecution (see 1838 Mormon War), now canonized by the church (D&C 123), that directed church leaders to establish a committee for “gathering up a knowledge of all the facts, and sufferings and abuses put on” church members, and the “names of all persons that have had a hand in their oppressions” (LDS Church 1992). The statement indicated that the members were then James E. Faust and Russell M. Nelson of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles.
In 1993, apostle Dallin H. Oaks characterized the committee as a “clipping service” that “may have monitored speeches, writings and activities of those suspected of apostasy and passed on material to church officials” (Arizona Republic 1993).
On our tour of the conference center, the tour guide suggested that we multiply the square footage of the building by the average cost per foot for commercial real estate to come up with our own estimate. That’s as close an answer as we got.
As to the three hour block, I know who it wasn’t……In the old days, my companion and I were in a remote area of Brazil. People struggled getting to church, attendance was low for the three different meetings. We consolidated them. Attendance was way up, we actually had enough people to teach classes, etc. We wrote the mission president of our great success. He wrote back upset saying, “Elder, make the church look like the church.” He either didn’t like the idea or he felt lower attendance made the church look like the church in Brazil. Per his wishes, we went back to old ways and old attendance.
#24 – That’s just sad.
Joshua, you’re only partly correct. Gileadi was one of the ones counted as one of the September 6. He has been rebaptized, but he was excommunicated at that time. This site quotes the Tribune article:
#21 – Almost correct!
The Colonel begins actively franchising his chicken business by traveling from town to town and cooking batches of chicken for restaurant owners and employees.
The Colonel awards Pete Harman of Salt Lake City with the first KFC franchise. A handshake agreement stipulates a payment of a nickel to Sanders for each chicken sold.
The biggest franchiser was LDS.
Great post! I wish I knew the answers.
About “Strengthening The Church Members Committee: who are these guys? (ex-CIA?)..Are they watchin’ us now?”
Yes, they are certainly watching us!
A small anecdote: I baptized an elderly man on my mission in mid ’80s but he died 2 months later, so I sent in the paperwork for proxy endowment to the Sao Paulo temple explaining the story and that I felt it a responsibility to do so. They promised to do it that week but also mentioned that members who die unendowed are automatically added to the proxy list 5 years after death.
Fast forward to 1998 and a high priest class in australia I was giving. We had a visitor from Salt Lake, a manager from records & stats who was there to do an audit. During the class I started to tell the story of this brother who died 2 months after baptizm and this manager, from Salt Lake whom I’d never met before, interrupted to say “and you where the missionary who sent in the letter and form requesting proxy work…..” etc. At first I said yes and told the story. But then it hit me, he worked in Salt Lake city, this was some 12 years after sending 1 letter to a temple in south america which wasn’t public at all with a standard form (back then) and he knew all about them! Seems the church not only doesn’t delete any letters at all but also attaches all correspondence and acts (for lack of a better word) that members do to their membership records, and this can then be seen by records/stats people for ever-after plus by general authorities.
Since then I’ve come to believe that the church offices are actually the real Big Brother and the best secret combination this planet has. It’s incredibly secretive and keeps records on all members -just like the stasi did with German citizens. Amazing!
I had lunch w/ Gileadi a few months back. MAN was that fascinating. For those of you who know me, remind me to tell you the story sometime. It literally blew my mind.
“Who appoints the director of the Ensign?”
By Director, do you mean the General Authority in charge, or the Church civil servant? There is a General Authority adviser for each of the four Church magazines, and they report to another General Authority, who serves as the Executive Director of the Curriculum Department. I would assume that either the Executive Director or the members of the Twelve he reports to (on the Priesthood Executive Council) would appoint the highest-ranking Church employee over the magazines, the Managing Director of the Curriculum Department.
The SCMC just attached that to your membership record. Prepare to be disciplined.
#29 — I have always wanted to hear his story. He’s the only one the Sept. 6 about whom I know virtually nothing (except that he got in trouble for a series of Isiah lecture, or something along those lines). Unlike the others, I’ve never read any articles by or about him purpoting to “set the record” straight, and I don’t think he took part in Sunstone’s “10 years after” panel in 1993 (Am I wrong about that, Matt T.?) I’ll have to take you up on that offer next time I’m in Logan, John. In the meantime, perhaps a new Mormon Stories podcast is in order?
Who are those guys that made the policy to go to a straight 3 hour block? Is it done by the prophet and apostles or is their a team of researchers that correlate with them?
I know the answer to that one. Various people worked on that, as one of many projects. However, the president of the Church made the decision, then asked for some help on putting things together to discuss it with the general authorities. I know very few of the actual details other than:
(a) the pilot projects and
(b) some of the details on the presentation (a very minor thing about putting some quotes in order).
As far as I could tell, non-general authorities got to do things at the level of making photocopies in that decision.
Though I don’t know what prompted the pilot programs. The Church does things like that all the time (sees something, runs a pilot program and then prays about it and decides whether or not to implement the program on a broader scale. They get ideas from everywhere it seems).
I’d love to hear the story, thank you.
Gileadi has never considered himself to be part of the September 6. He really, really dislikes any association with them. He’s on the completely opposite side of the scale.
“I thought I read some where that FAIR use outside staff (non-members) in their research. If so, who are these guys?”
This question isn’t very clear. First of all, FAIR has no inside “staff.” It’s completely a volunteer, shoe-string, unpaid association. Secondly, there are degrees of involvement, so it depends what aspect of FAIR you’re asking about. Presentations at the FAIR conference? Posts on the blog? Wiki content? FAIR certainly *cites* lots of non-FAIR and non-LDS sources and people. There are people who present, edit, etc. who are not on the internal email list. I guess that’s a shotgun answer to a vague question.
Also, if you want to read about the creation of correlation, check out the McKay biography by Prince. It has a whole chapter on it. I’m not sure it jives exactly with James’ explanation above, but its a written source you can go to.
37 Thanks Ben
Your second precise paragraph,answers my vague question!
I will also check out the McKay Biography by Prince.
38 John Nillson
“Who appoints the director of the Ensign?” Once again your second paragraph answered the question. I did mean Civil Servant which I should have clarified
28 Carlos J- Interesting stuff on Strengthening the Church Committee.
20 Clay – Colonel Sanders – This is deep stuff!!
24 Holden Caulfield- Your Mission president – the spirit of the law thing went over his head.
29 John Dehlin
That would be great to hear!!
I had lunch w/ Gileadi a few months back. MAN was that fascinating. For those of you who know me, remind me to tell you the story sometime. It literally blew my mind.
31 Single Speed – Liked your quote “Every Sunday I sneak off to an LDS church my family have no I idea where I am
For the record (in case the SCMC is reading), that is not *my* quote. I merely [illegally] posted copyrighted material from PostSecret.
John Dehlin (29)
I am sorry to hear that your mind has literally been blown. That sounds like it would hurt.
You’ve asked “who are those guys?” Him therefore, whom ye ignorantly follow, declare I unto you. The answer is, the invisible servants of the ‘god of this world’, who in turn is a metaphor for their governing philosophy. They govern you by lies. All lies. Nothing but lies. Virtually everything you think you know is a lie. Your entire world-view is a lie. It’s been that way since ‘the fall’. At some point, it’s time to wake up and realize this fact. But to do so is scary. You have to take total responsibility for your morality, your beliefs, your life, and the use of your light. For that reason, most people never do it. They tacitly accept their slavery, considering it better than having to face the uncertainty by themselves. For those of you who are not willing to sacrifice everything for the truth, now is the time to stop reading.
There is nowhere that the lie is more easily grasped than in religion. If you can bring yourself to read the following paragraphs with an open mind, your true freedom can begin in just a few minutes. The rulers of this world worship the heavens. They delight in getting you to ignorantly do the same. How so? Let me explain. What are the major doctrines of the Church? The ‘son’ is born of a virgin on December 25th, he’s surrounded by 12 apostles who are characterized as ‘fishermen’, he conducts a saving mission bringing light and life to the world, he’s abandoned by his apostles when he wears his red robes and treads the wine-press of the wrath of God alone, he dies on the cross effecting the atonement, he’s buried in a tomb for 3 days, during which time, he preaches to the spirits in prison, after this, he is resurrected, born again, the first fruits of the resurrection, and as a result, his resurrection passes to all, he then ascends into the heavens wearing his white garments showing he has overcome and put all his enemies under his feet.
This Jesus Christ is the personification of the solar disk, and nothing more. 2,000 years ago, the people who ran the world were then headquartered in Rome. They needed a religion to unify the empire. They looked around for raw material and found ‘pagan sun worshipers’. These sun worshipers drew the circle of the horizon and connected the cardinal points of the compass, much the same as Catholics do today when they cross themselves, north, south, east, and west. This formed what was known as the ‘solar cross’. When you see it today, it’s called the Celtic Cross. They put the sun on the center of the cross, hence the circular center of the Celtic Cross. They told the story of the sun, born on December 25th. This is the first day the sun starts it’s northward journey, once again rising above the horizon in the northern latitudes and starting its mission of bringing light and life to the world. It is born of the virgin mother earth and surrounded by the 12 signs of the zodiac who accompany him during his mission. Since Christianity was designed to be the religion of the world during the age of Pisces, the ‘apostles’, who were the personified zodiac, were characterized as fishermen. The sun gradually moves higher in the sky until the summer solstice, when it ends its northward progression and starts to sink into the southern sky again. As it nears the horizon, the sun is red, thus the red robes of the wrath of god. When, at the winter solstice the sun sinks below the horizon, it doesn’t rise again. The sun seems to stay at the same southern terminus of its journey for three days, actually remaining below the horizon in the northern latitudes, thus having died and been buried for three days. Then, on December 25, after three days in the tomb, the sun once again starts its northward journey, being resurrected or born again, the first-fruits of the resurrection, to once again climb into the sky. This resurrection of the sun allows it to bring light and life to the world once again, so that after a few months the bunnies pop out of the ground and life is renewed. Thus the atonement passes to all.
With this simple lie, we and our parents and their parents have been kept in servitude for 2,000 years to a priesthood who pretends to have a relationship with god that we must shelter under to avoid being cast down to hell. Ever wonder why all of a sudden there’s such an attack on Christianity in our country? We’re entering the age of Aqarius. It’s time for the religion of the new age. But you don’t really expect them to tell you that they lied to you before and it’s time to replace the old lies with some new lies do you? Plus conflict is great for keeping people in line. If you don’t believe me, look at the old testament and you can see Moses keeping his people in line by punishing the Israelites for worshipping a golden calf when Moses wanted them to move from the old age’s religion of Taurus (the bull) to the ‘new’ age’s religion of Aries (the ram), who ‘god’ miraculously provided caught in a thicket. Or you can read about ‘Christ’ telling his followers they should reject the old religion of Aries, to follow his ‘fishermen’ apostles for the age of Pisces. Do you really want to be manipulated like this?
Does it really matter if religion is a lie if it makes people happy? Yes indeed, unless you think it’s a good thing for you to make decisions based on lies and that theft by fraud is a good vocation for those who run your life. If you think about the multitude of decisions you make about how things should be, based on this lie, you’ll begin to understand how your thoughts and life is manipulated for their purposes. Think of the billions of dollars that have been looted from our country’s treasury for the benefit of arms dealers (many run by the same people that run our country) by the simple expedient of getting Christians to fight with Muslims; or the billions of dollars that have been sent to Israel by the United States based on the support we give them based entirely on the lie that they’re god’s chosen people (by the way, it’s nearly as easy to show that the entire old testament is material lifted from earlier Egyptian and Summerian myths). Do you really believe that the all-knowing, all-loving Father of everyone on the planet is such a jerk that he has a favorite kid and the rest of us are dirt? Wake up. Experience true freedom. Learn to love and do right because it’s the right thing to do, not because you’re afraid of Daddy. And also learn to recognize when you’re being lied to. To quote the late Huey Long, “You can tell when they’re lying. If their lips are moving, they’re lying.”