Voting — 2008 Niblet Awards

And the nominees are . . .

1 – Best BIG Blog (links provided)

Time to Vote!

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2 – Best GROUP Blog (links provided)

Time to vote!

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3 – Best SOLO blog:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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4 – Best NEW blog:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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5 – Best blog LAYOUT/GRAPHICS:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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6 – Best COMMENTER:  (sorry, no links!)

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7 – Most memorable COMMENT:

Time to vote!

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8 – Best overall BLOGGER:  (sorry, no links!)

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9 – Best HUMOROUS post:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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10 – Best HISTORICAL post:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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11 – Best SPIRITUAL post:  (some links provided)

Time to vote!

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12 – Best DOCTRINAL post:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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13 – Best CURRENT EVENTS post:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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14 – Best PROP 8/SSM post:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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15 – Best MITT ROMNEY Post:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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16 – NICEST “EVIL VILLAIN”/Wolf in Sheep’s Clothing:  (links provided)

Time to vote!

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17 – Most blatant example of NAVEL-GAZING:  (links provided)

Time to Vote!

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18 – Best CONTRIBUTION to the Bloggernacle in 2008:

Time to Vote!

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19 – WRITE-IN category:  (you may vote for up to 3)

Time to vote!

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Thanks for doing your civic duty by voting, and thanks to all the contributors who made 2008 a banner year for the Bloggernacle!  We’re sure there are many more outstanding contributions than could be covered by this nomination process.  See you all again in 6-7 months for the 2009 Niblets Awards!

Comments welcome below.



237 comments for “Voting — 2008 Niblet Awards

  1. Kaimi
    July 6, 2009 at 12:37 am

    Lots of tough categories to vote in: Best blogger, best commenter, humorous, doctrinal — there’s lots of worthy entries.

    Good job to MM and Batman for putting this together, it’s always fun and interesting.

  2. Rebecca
    July 6, 2009 at 12:37 am

    Um – in most humerous post, you link to my page at fMh but say Rebecca J – we’re 2 different people. Rebecca J posts at BCC. I’m not sure my posts are ever funny (unless me being in the category is supposed to be some kind of insult!) whereas Rebecca J at BCC has written some brilliantly funny posts over at BCC.

  3. Kaimi
    July 6, 2009 at 12:56 am

    Yep, the original nomination appears to have been for Rebecca J at BCC (see ). FMH Becky is a fine blogger, but not particularly known as a bloggernacle humorist; her specialties run more towards interesting international-church discussions and fun advent celebrations.

  4. July 6, 2009 at 4:48 am

    Fixed–thanks, guys.

  5. Ray
    July 6, 2009 at 6:50 am

    Thanks for doing this. It has been a real treat re-reading these posts.

  6. Rick M
    July 6, 2009 at 6:59 am

    This thread may end up in a category, itself. Great job, Batman.

  7. Justin
    July 6, 2009 at 9:19 am

    One suggestion: remove the “view results” buttons. The ability to see the current results encourages ballot stuffing, IMO.

  8. annegb
    July 6, 2009 at 9:19 am

    I’ve really enjoyed clicking on the links–you guys did a good job setting this up.

  9. Kevin Barney
    July 6, 2009 at 9:21 am

    Wow, you guys did a terrific job with this. Kudos.

  10. RuthAnn
    July 6, 2009 at 9:21 am

    Just a vote

  11. July 6, 2009 at 9:28 am

    Thanks for putting this together. I always love the Niblets. It’s nice to reflect on the past year in the ‘nacle. (It’s weird – I’ve been around for about 3 years now. I guess that makes me at least a medium-timer, if not an old-timer.)

  12. Hawkgrrrl
    July 6, 2009 at 10:43 am

    Justin – that is apparently not an option with our plugin, sorry to say. However, there are some restrictions on multiple voting to prevent ballot-stuffers from getting too far.

  13. Rebecca J
    July 6, 2009 at 11:36 am

    we’re 2 different people

    On the other hand, have you ever seen us together in the same room?

  14. July 6, 2009 at 12:01 pm

    I don’t have an opinion on some categories — best Prop 8 post, or best Romney post — and if others are in a similar position on some categories, I understand some of the disparity in vote totals among the various categories. I would expect, though, that the vote total would be very similar within certain groups — big blog, group blog, solo blog, new blog, for instance, because those who read multiple blogs are likely to have an opinion in all those categories.

    What does it mean, though, when one category within a group has a 10% higher vote tally than the others in the same group? Is someone ballot-stuffing by calling in his aunts and cousins to vote in a single election?

  15. Hawkgrrrl
    July 6, 2009 at 12:14 pm

    Ardis – I have to think that with Facebook and Twitter, this year’s Niblets is going to be a little different. Since the b’nacle is open to all who care to read/lurk/comment, we can’t restrict who votes either. After all, nothing is at stake but the, ahem, honor and prestige and bragging rights. Oh, and that gold-plated ear of corn.

  16. July 6, 2009 at 12:17 pm

    Dear admins,

    You have Blake’s prop 8 post in the wrong category. It should be under Prop 8 and not under Romney posts.

  17. July 6, 2009 at 12:29 pm

    *calling aunts and cousins, and buying popcorn*

  18. Brother Matsby
    July 6, 2009 at 12:30 pm

    Dear admins,

    My cousins and aunts have been telling me they are having a problem submitting votes from each of their computers. Just thought you may want to take a look into it. Thanks.

  19. Hawkgrrrl
    July 6, 2009 at 12:30 pm

    Geoff J – resolved. Thanks!

    Bro. Matsby – sounds like user error. Is it plugged in??

  20. Brother Matsby
    July 6, 2009 at 12:39 pm

    My goal for the 2009 Niblets is to win “Most Missed”

  21. Brother Matsby
    July 6, 2009 at 12:50 pm

    Oh nevermind Hawkgrrrrl. It turns out they were voting against me anyway.

    (We’re not a really close family)

  22. July 6, 2009 at 1:07 pm

    On the other hand, have you ever seen us together in the same room?
    That must be the humorous Rebecca.

  23. July 6, 2009 at 1:11 pm

    It pains me just a little bit that I’m tied with Aaron Shaf for niceness. I’m going to hell.

  24. Anonymous
    July 6, 2009 at 1:20 pm

    Deer readers**: That’s not fair – ppl with a lot of relatives obviously have an unfair advantage!*
    * pls mispell the first word in your subsequent comment: the number of e’s* in the mispelled word will henceforth be taken to represent the number of dollars you are offering per vote – a real bargain if you or your blog is nominated in more than one category! also, to those wishing to accept such an indusement: mispell in the same way the first word of an email sent that commenter….
    ** (I’m not nominated but if someone figures out how to email me, pls paypal me the mere pittance of two dollars and let’s say i’ll know what to do.)

  25. July 6, 2009 at 3:24 pm

    #14. I don’t know about other blogs, but those voting for Linescratchers, for instance, are people coming from my blog… which is a LDS music/musician’s blog. They probably don’t know what a Bloggernacle is, so they’re really just single-issue voters. If there are other similar situations it might explain discrepancies in voting from one category to the next.

  26. Paula
    July 6, 2009 at 6:04 pm

    Why are some entries showing as having a negative percentage of the vote? Currently the bottom entry in humorous posts looks like this:
    jamesbarjoseph’s “Nothing Wavering” (-4%, 1 Votes)

    Also, the link for Police Beat Roundtable under SSM posts doesn’t go to a specific post.

  27. July 6, 2009 at 6:36 pm

    In 7 shouldn’t it say “DKL “taking it on the jaw from Jesus” instead of “for” Jesus? It is still getting votes, so I guess people are figuring it out.

  28. Hawkgrrrl
    July 6, 2009 at 6:44 pm

    Jacob J – “taking it on the jaw for Jesus” sounds like a good slogan for a tee shirt from a Christian Fight Club.

  29. Tom
    July 6, 2009 at 8:39 pm

    I thought Matsby’s Eight Ball posts were way better than GC lolcat. Byt GC lolcat was pretty good, don’t get me wrong.

    But nothing, and I mean nothing, can beat the Daily Universe police beat for sheer hilarity.

  30. Zack
    July 6, 2009 at 9:41 pm
  31. July 6, 2009 at 10:49 pm

    re 30:

    Zack, it’s 5 days too late for the 2008 Niblets (at least, it says to me it was written in 2009). Definitely keep that link on hand when we do the 2009 Niblets though.

  32. Nathan
    July 7, 2009 at 8:55 am

    TAMN needs to win all of these for her satirical and honest view into the materialism and fake happiness/spirituality of Mormon women! This kind of thing will always happen when a religion is led by men and his laws

  33. July 7, 2009 at 9:37 am

    Why isn’t there a link to David’s “Teaching About Racism (Including the Priesthood Ban) in Sacrament Meeting” in best historical post? Here’s the link:

  34. July 7, 2009 at 10:05 am

    Got it, Christopher. Our apologies to David and to JI.

  35. gst
    July 7, 2009 at 10:21 am

    Are there restrictions on electioneering within a certain distance from the polling station?

  36. July 7, 2009 at 10:24 am

    Thanks, Biv.

  37. July 7, 2009 at 10:44 am

    I want everyone to note that currently DKL is in both first and second place in the same category. Ardis, take note, you could have your categories, you could have become the Michael Phelps of the 2008 Niblets, but instead you’ll just be the Dara Torres.

  38. July 7, 2009 at 12:03 pm

    My malicious dig at Aaron seems to have put me over the top in the meanest villain category. bwahahahahaa

  39. July 7, 2009 at 12:07 pm

    What? How is Aaron Shafavoloff getting more votes that Chris Smith in the nicest evil villain category? Far be it from me to question democracy… but what the heck? :-/

  40. Lisa
    July 7, 2009 at 5:32 pm

    I am a lurker of the Bloggernacle and need to voice my disdain, disappointment, and disgust that Ronan and Tracy M were not nominated for best overall blogger. Kudos on these Niblets, yes, but shame, shame for “forgetting” those two.

  41. Ronan
    July 7, 2009 at 5:41 pm

    Tracy does indeed rock. Cheers, Lisa.

  42. Kaimi
    July 7, 2009 at 6:26 pm

    Tracy does rock. You should have nominated her, Lisa!

  43. Ray
    July 7, 2009 at 7:49 pm

    In our defense, Tracy M is leading in a very important category: “Best contribution to the Bloggernacle in 2008”. That is well-deserved.

  44. Ray
    July 7, 2009 at 8:29 pm

    Just for the record, Bro. Gatsby is paying people – by reducing his rates for ward-level vicarious work.

  45. July 7, 2009 at 8:53 pm

    Ray, thank you so much for nominating me. It touches me that so many people think what I write has value.

  46. July 7, 2009 at 8:55 pm

    Oh, and besides rocking, which he does, Ronan also looks better in trousers than do I. Or at least that’s what I’m told.

  47. July 7, 2009 at 9:34 pm

    I am disturbed that Julie Smith’s post “Blood on the doorsteps” waws nominated for a niblet. I mean really, and yes, I just reread the entire thread, she equates, very close to explicitly, supporting Same Sex Marriage with having your firstborn killed? I understand she is some sort of saint above reproach because she teaches her poor bewildered offspring dead languages, but really, that post was truly beyond the pale. And I’m (at least partly) Irish, so I can complain. Also, her main point, that the friend that had the pro-anti-gay marriage sign in her yard and imagined mayhem on the horizon, but actually had not a single negative repercussion (as she herself admits wayy wayy down at the bottom of the thread) rather negates her point.

  48. July 7, 2009 at 9:38 pm

    OK, on rereading, I realise that my post came across as mean-spirited, but everyone loves Julie, and would hate me, if given the chance. But my point remains. She screams (with bare metaphoric overtones) “dead male firstborns” and then capitulates at the very end, after all but the most OCD have given up.

  49. July 8, 2009 at 5:52 am

    djinn, we love you, but please master symbolism before critiquing any more blog posts.
    I say this as someone who disagrees with Julie’s point of view, but admires the way she expressed it.

  50. Peter LLC
    July 8, 2009 at 6:18 am

    Ronan also looks better in trousers than do I.

    While he would be the last to admit it, he also looks better in a dress than do you.

  51. July 8, 2009 at 7:54 am

    #49. “djinn, we love you, but please master symbolism before critiquing any more blog posts.”

    Yeah djinn. Your post was like a leaf falling over a rolling stream in Winter.

  52. July 8, 2009 at 9:13 am

    I don’t think it’s very good to pitch parody blogs like Srsly So Blssd and Bro. Matsby’s against blogs like Ardis’s. I propose that next year there be a separate category for the funny blogs.

    I further propose that I be named the honorary winner of the best solo blog category based on this suggestion.

  53. Brother Matsby
    July 8, 2009 at 9:38 am

    I can agree with that. I feel somewhat strange being in the SOLO Blog category. It seems like a “solo blog” maybe should be someone who takes the Bloggernacle more seriously.

    On the other hand I am honored to be nominated.

  54. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 9:56 am

    I’d like to be nominated in the Han Solo Blog category, except that HACK Harrison Ford would probably start a new site just to sweep another award.

  55. Rach
    July 8, 2009 at 10:47 am

    These links are fantastic.

    And, I agree with the earlier suggestion that Seriously So Blessed should have its own category. I have laughed incredibly hard at it many times and think it’s an, um, unique contribution to the Bloggernacle but definitely in a different way than any of the other blogs here. For example, to see it in “the big blog” category with BCC and FMH and T&S is really funny.

    P.S. Ardis is so thoughtful and reflective and TAMN is so hilariously, satirically narcissistic that to have them both nominated for “best solo blog” is definitely apples and oranges. Or apples and ice cream. Or something.

  56. Jeff Spector
    July 8, 2009 at 10:50 am

    Is campainging allowed here? You must be 100 feet from the polling place…. 🙂

  57. Paula
    July 8, 2009 at 11:10 am

    I hate to ask this question, knowing of the history 🙂 — but how do you define “big blog”? I’m guessing that if you go by # of readers, Seriouslysoblessed is right up there with FMH, and probably higher than MM. Also, as far as I’ve noticed, she hasn’t done any campaigning for votes at her site or on facebook or twitter. I think that the votes for seriouslysoblessed would go up markedly if she did. I think that a separate category for satire or humor might be appropriate, but really it’s also a solo blog, a new blog, and a big blog.

  58. July 8, 2009 at 11:59 am

    Paula, she did actually campaign on her blog yesterday which was really what prompted me to post a link at fMh. When I saw that she’d pulled ahead of us yesterday I checked. Couldn’t be losing to the for-profit industrial blog.

    These categories have been a challenge from the beginning, these blog things are so fluid n stuff. I think letting the nominators decide is as good a solution as any in this crazy internets. Though personally I do think that SSB is really of a different nature than the other blogs in the big category. She’s more of a Dooce kinda money making humor thing, not really a community discussion bloggernacle kinda thing.

  59. Paula
    July 8, 2009 at 12:08 pm

    Lisa, I didn’t see that, so my bad. SSB is different in some ways than many of the blogs here, so I suppose that the categories might be better defined next time the Niblets happened. I am fairly sure that SSB was not started as a commercial blog, but when it took off, she took advantage of it.

  60. mfranti
    July 8, 2009 at 12:11 pm

    “Couldn’t be losing to the for-profit industrial blog. ”

    thank you for saying it!

  61. mfranti
    July 8, 2009 at 12:12 pm

    “She’s more of a Dooce kinda money making humor thing, not really a community discussion bloggernacle kinda thing.”

    and this too.

  62. Danny
    July 8, 2009 at 12:25 pm


  63. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 12:33 pm

    Lisa, couldn’t agree more with your #58. SSB is not a part of the Bloggernacle in terms of engaging with the community at all. It’s another Dooce/c jane site that entertains as it monetizes. It’s a great site with great content, but makes no effort to engage the bloggernacle community per se.

  64. Rach
    July 8, 2009 at 12:43 pm

    fmhlisa, as far as I’ve seen, TAMN twittered about it but has not put anything on facebook or blogged about it. If she were to, I agree with Paula that the results would change considerably.

    Yes, SSB has ads, while the other ones nominated don’t (as far as I know). But I think she pokes fun in an entertaining way at a lot of cultural things that get discussed in other tones in the Bloggernacle (racism, materialism, modesty, gender roles, vanity, selfishness, etc.). I really don’t think just having ads turns someone into “an industrial for profit” blog.

    I sense a few sour grapes.

  65. Danny
    July 8, 2009 at 12:55 pm

    Would SSB’s mass of voters really know anything about the Bloggernacle and have interest in the overall Mormon discussion (which is the whole point)?

  66. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 1:13 pm

    My only beef with SSB is that country music soundtrack on the site. Anytime I click on it, it blares that croony tripe and makes it completely impossible to covertly read it during work hours.

  67. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 1:55 pm

    Danny’s point is right on. It’s nothing to do with the quality of the site; it’s about SSB being miscategorized as part of the Bloggernacle, when it clearly isn’t. Not all sites by or about Mormons are part of the Bloggernacle. That’s not a mystery to understand.

  68. July 8, 2009 at 2:19 pm

    Knowing that any whiff of complaint would be met with charges of sour grapes,I’ve hesitated to say anything. I sense the same hesitation in the tentative comments of people who *have* dared to speak up, so I’ll risk it and say this:

    I’m flattered to be doing so well in the “best overall blogger” category. I hadn’t expected that. That category, as I see it, is a recognition not just of the quality of a blog, but of the efforts to build Bloggernacle community by commenting at other blogs, promoting other — usually smaller — blogs with links in a sidebar, generally being a good citizen. I don’t know Tamn at all, don’t read his/her blog, frankly had never even heard of it until the Niblets. So how does someone whose blog isn’t generally recognized as part of the Bloggernacle, doesn’t promote other blogs, doesn’t participate in discussions, doesn’t have a presence in any way, out-polling bloggers like Kevin Barney and Margaret Young and Kaimi and Steve Evans and others who do so much to keep us from being merely a collection of isolated and unrelated blogs? Something isn’t right there.

  69. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 2:28 pm

    No hesitation here, Ardis. You nailed it.

  70. July 8, 2009 at 2:32 pm

    And while I’m at it —

    I guess I’m among the bewildered and humor-deficient, but how does something like Tamners Goes to Washington out-poll Jared T. in the “current events” category? That is inexplicable. “Explicable” requires some quality of rationality and recognition of the on-going efforts of Jared T. and Juvenile Instructor to keep those of us who can’t attend all the Mormon Studies events informed through magnificently detailed reports of those events. JI is in a category all its own when it comes to current events blogging.

    Next go ’round, we ought to vote on best book reviews, too. A showdown between JI and J. Stapley and a few others would be a magnificent competition. As long as the competition were legitimate, that is, and not mucked up by the nomination of some spoof of a review.

  71. mfranti
    July 8, 2009 at 2:35 pm

    here’s a big virtual kiss and hug for ardis.

  72. Paula
    July 8, 2009 at 2:46 pm

    Hmm, so you know who TAMN is? Are you absolutely sure she (or he, I suppose) doesn’t participate in the Bloggernacle?

    I have no real dog in this fight, but I did nominate SSB in the first place, for best new blog, I think. I jokingly added links for other awards, not thinking that all would get put in the voting. I think I also nominated Ardis or keepapitchinin for best solo, but I thought that both should be in the running for several awards. SSB is very successful, witty, original, and from what I hear attracting a lot of daily readers. What’s wrong with that?

  73. July 8, 2009 at 2:47 pm

    Thanks for the kind words, Ardis. At the risk of sounding sour-grapsey, I think what has been expressed here is correct. Further, it seems that the nomination process has some difficulties to work out. I mean, Best contribution to the Bloggernacle in 2008, myregisblog for all the fun and laughs? Really? And the fact that it’s only one vote away from Emily’s Bloggernacle Back Bench/Today In The Bloggernacle contribution is simply beyond my capacity for belief. Whether it’s a matter of categorization or simple common sense (Tamn-Best Overall Blogger…Really???), something should be different next year with how the nominations are conducted. Ditto to the previous sentiments about the aforementioned blogs/bloggers not being a part of the “bloggernacle”.

    Thanks to Steve for your thoughts as well.

  74. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 3:03 pm

    Paula: “Hmm, so you know who TAMN is? Are you absolutely sure she (or he, I suppose) doesn’t participate in the Bloggernacle?”

    The very fact that you have to ask the question shows that they do not participate in the Bloggernacle, at least not via the sites for which they were nominated. TAMN could really be Julie Smith for all I know, but I know that “TAMN” and “Seriously So Blessed” do not participate in the Bloggernacle.

  75. July 8, 2009 at 3:05 pm

    “Hmm, so you know who TAMN is? Are you absolutely sure she (or he, I suppose) doesn’t participate in the Bloggernacle?”

    Paula, I think you’re spot off on that observation. It doesn’t matter who TAMN “really” is, or whether this person participates in the Bloggernacle (ie, comments, links, posts, building and engaging the community) under some other name, but TAMN as a persona is up for the nomination and no, does not participate as far as I and others have seen. There is something wrong with that.

    I already made a note about the nomination selection process (or lack thereof), but I’d like to extend it to include a hope that those doing the nominating might be a little more responsible when they haphazardly make nominations.

  76. July 8, 2009 at 3:06 pm

    Ah, Steve beat me to it, and in a much more succinct fashion. Thanks.

  77. July 8, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    Rach, it really was on her blog yesterday, I swear.

  78. July 8, 2009 at 3:22 pm

    So why is it absurd that My Regis Blog be considered a contribution to the community?

  79. Rach
    July 8, 2009 at 3:25 pm

    All the things being said about SSB also true for the my religious blog, which also isn’t in the “greater community” and is also trying to run ads. Not bad, just different from Mormon Matters and BCC and such. Anyway, I enjoy and follow and really value a lot of the blogs on here, and hope Ardis wins just about everything she’s up for. Like I said, apples and ice cream.

    fmhlisa, maybe you saw her twitter feed on the bottom of her blog. I subscribe and there is no way she blogged about it.

    And I enjoy this collection of links, but agree with the MMW pingback that says these awards seem to just breed contention. Next time, consider just take nominations and say “these are some of the highlights of 2008”? With the campaigning and ballot stuffing that goes on, the actual “winners” seem to mean little and it sounds like a lot of great bloggers are taking them awfully seriously. Is there a calling and election made sure award that goes to the winner I don’t know about? 🙂

  80. July 8, 2009 at 3:34 pm

    I have posted on BCC as a guest blogger and contributed multiple images for their site. I have also participated in the comments section of multiple blogs in the community most especially at BCC. I also am one of the contributers to a twitterfeed which reviews bloggernacle posts.

    The “ads” on my blog are a joke. One of them is obviously fictional. The other is one I put on as a link to my friend’s MySpace page. And the third was something I posted for free for another aquaintence. I have never recieved a penny as a result of my regis blog. Only sweet sweet heavenly treasures.

    If you have any other questions about my blog, please feel free to ask.

  81. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 3:40 pm

    Sounds like good feedback for the upcoming 2009 Niblets: improve the vetting process for nominations. Truth be told, nominations were accepted largely at face value, with the links provided so “the people” can vote based on what they think when they look at the links. I’m fine with better vetting of nominations. Point taken.

    On the issue of reasonableness of the people voting, we’ve got hundreds of voters, presumably with an average IQ of 100 (given the human average – maybe slightly higher due to being able to use a computer and actually click on radio buttons). Voting is always going to be prey to the same problem as all democracy. “The people” all have an equal voice, and they don’t have to be experts or reasonable or rationale or take things into account like overall contribution. We can put the best set of nominations in front of them, but the votes don’t have to make sense to anyone but the voter. Obviously, “the people” are doing a fairly good job based on Ardis’ and my own relative rankings.

  82. July 8, 2009 at 3:53 pm

    I LOVE the Niblets!!
    Have to say that I get a bit of a charge out of the controversy, too, but you know me.

    FMHLisa, You’re NOT going crazy, SSB had a little tiny notice on her sidebar telling her readers where to go to vote for her.

    It is true that some of these blogs might not be what all of us conceive of as the “Bloggernacle” community. However, we did open up nominations to the public this year. Last year there were complaints that the nomination process was too private, and MM agreed that everyone should be able to have a say in the nominations. SSB and MRB were both nominated by more than one person in the categories in which they appear. And the people who made nominations are participants in the Bloggernacle, I am personally familiar with almost all of them. In previous years Mormon Mommy Wars and some of the others have been nominated but this year they were not. They were welcome to come over and nominate themselves, too. So–Mormon Matters teaches correct principles and lets the Bloggernacle define itself!

    The Niblets affords a great opportunity to promote the Bloggernacle. I still think this aspect is coming along well. I think many people were able to review some of the high points of the year, even though many were missed. In addition, we were able to stretch ourselves to see some of the other things that other Bloggernacle participants are reading and that they find of interest. ALSO, some of the readership of these other blogs are coming over to see what is happening at the TRUE blogs. So, win/win situation all around.

    (Kaimi, I guess no one has discovered that you are the real TAMN yet!)

  83. Kaimi
    July 8, 2009 at 3:55 pm

    Well I have a question about your blog, Brother Matsby. I tried to come by last weekend for the Nephite RPG night you advertised, and there was *nobody* there. I am shocked and appalled that your blog would run that kind of false and scurrillouos advertising. (Also, I cannot spell scurrillous, which is probably your fault too). I plan to report you to the appropriate ecclesiastical authorities, as soon as I figure out who they are.

    That is all.

  84. Kaimi
    July 8, 2009 at 4:03 pm

    On a more serious note, I sustain everything that Ardis said.

    I don’t think that the nominations are a bad thing; it seems that a little more differentiation by category could address many of the concerns. I don’t want to downplay others’ blogs, but I do like our little bloggernacle community, and I think that there’s something to be said for community-building within the community.

    (And Hawkgrrl and BiV and Batman and others who have been involved in the process (Aquaman? Green Lantern?) — please don’t take this as an attack. I appreciate the work which you all put into the Niblets, and I think the revived Niblets have been a very good way to highlight some of the bloggernacle’s best. Please, view it as a gentle suggestion for next time. Thanks!)

  85. Kaimi
    July 8, 2009 at 4:04 pm

    Cheryl — sshh, don’t blow my cover! 😉

  86. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 4:10 pm

    Kaimi – shhh, don’t blow Cheryl’s cover!

    Perhaps a “Mommy Blogs” category is in order for future as well as a “for-profit, Mormon-related Blogs” category. I would also suggest we do something like “Bloggernacle Patron Saint” to cover the points listed by Ardis as a separate/additional category to best overall blogger. Or we could do best overall bloggers by categories – e.g. group, solo, etc.

    This is a good place to formulate the 2009 plan.

  87. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 4:11 pm

    BiV, I think you are unclear on the concept of “win/win”.

    No, it is bogus. That TAMN would win a “current events” post against Jared T’s excellent reporting is simply ridiculous. It is an example of why screening the nominations is important. It is also an example of what happens when an invasive culture disrupts an ecosystem.

    I don’t think we should, as a community, in good faith accept any bloggernacle award being given to a site that is not part of the Bloggernacle. And BiV, getting nominated does NOT make you part of the Bloggernacle; you know this. It is a slap in the community’s face to pretend otherwise.

    Nobody asked MM to host these awards — you guys decided to do it on your own, knowing that each year there are problems with the process and a lot of controversy. Well, now you’ve got your own problems and controversy to deal with. I would recommend that you approach these issues in a way that does not piss on your friends in order to cater to an outsider like SSB.

  88. July 8, 2009 at 4:12 pm

    This is why we have the Electoral College and not a direct vote.

    Ardis is right on.

  89. July 8, 2009 at 4:17 pm

    Now I know how those Iranians feel.

  90. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 4:20 pm

    Tracy M – not to threadjack, but this is first time I’ve ever seen anyone outside of the state of Rhode Island defending the electoral college at least in the last hundred years or so.

    I do get what everyone is saying. BiV does also. We’ll have some great analysis done by Ziff, and credit will go where it is due. No disrespect has been intended. The purpose here is to honor the contributions of those who’ve brought the b’nacle to where it is today and to further promote it.

  91. mfranti
    July 8, 2009 at 4:20 pm

    take to the streets!

  92. July 8, 2009 at 4:26 pm

    This is why Madonna is in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame… but Alice Cooper isn’t.

  93. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 4:27 pm

    Hawkgrrl, I think you will have to admit that the polls thus far are not working to achieve those goals you name. TAMN receiving twice as many votes as Kevin Barney as best overall blogger? That can only be described as a failure compared to your stated purpose.

  94. Ray
    July 8, 2009 at 4:28 pm

    Three things:

    1) While I agree with the major points of concern about the process, it was done largely in response to the mitching that happened last year. The process will get refined for next year – and I personally have no problem taking the voting and tweaking the actual awards slightly. I don’t see that as illegitimate in any way, as long as those who received the top votes still get recognized in a significant way.

    2) “I would recommend that you approach these issues in a way that does not piss on your friends in order to cater to an outsider like SSB.”

    No pissing occurred, and no catering occurred. None. Frankly, nobody involved in the process would do either – wouldn’t even consider either.

  95. ECS
    July 8, 2009 at 4:28 pm

    There’s absolutely no way I could be a better blogger than Lynnette and Kiskilli, but thanks very much for the votes!

  96. July 8, 2009 at 4:30 pm

    I love you, but that’s just garbage. Catering = Giving equal weight to TAMN and Margaret Young on “Best Blogger” by putting them on the same ballot.

  97. July 8, 2009 at 4:31 pm

    *grabs for popcorn*

  98. July 8, 2009 at 4:32 pm

    Folks, I think that Hawkgrrl and Batman and the rest of the Justice League of America here have done as good of a job as could be expected to be flexible. They split categories as suggested in nominations, added categories (Best Prop 8, Best Evil Villian), and took every reasonable step to set up a vote that reflected people’s suggestions and ideas. There were 200 comments in the two nominations posts, and *no one mentioned this then.*

    I think that Ardis and Steve are right that it’s silly to call SSB part of the bloggernacle, just like it would be silly to include Dooce or CJane. They’re a different audience and a different community. (And yes, I realize that the bloggernacle is made up of several overlapping communities, but SSB seems to be essentially outside of the cluster.)

    But I don’t think it’s right to go postal on MM or Hawkgirl about it. One of us should have caught this before the final ballot printed. If we think that it’s a silly inclusion (and it is), we can just put an asterisk next to it in our personal read of the voting.

  99. July 8, 2009 at 4:35 pm

    I still think you guys did a great job on the niblets this year. I totally agree with what Ardis said about building community. The thing that struck me when reading the “best overall blogger” category is that most of the people on the list don’t get out much. Even the bloggernacle icons with plenty of bone fides tend to comment a lot at their own blogs and not much anywhere else (which is cool, but not enough to get best overall blogger vote from me). Which is why I’m glad Ardis is winning. I neither know nor care who Tamn is. I have mentally filtered Tamn from the list.

  100. July 8, 2009 at 4:36 pm

    Speaking of which, Bro. Matsby, that RPG ad is freaking hilarious.

  101. July 8, 2009 at 4:37 pm

    No one mentioned it in the nominations, but we were all talking about it behind the scenes. The reason no one brought it up publicly is because no one actually believed that no critical analysis of nominations would be given. Our bad!

  102. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 4:37 pm

    Ray, you’re mistaken about the pissing and catering. Characterizing our complaints as “great ideas for the 2009 Niblets,” (thereby avoiding any present responsibility) or saying that these polls are the simple result of the “bloggernacle governing itself” is both catering to the status quo as well as showing disrespect to the community. If this is about celebrating each other and recognizing the best work we’ve all done together, then FIX IT, RAY. Don’t justify it.

    Yes, pissing and catering.

  103. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 4:38 pm

    BTW I doubt you’re hosting the Niblets next year.

  104. July 8, 2009 at 4:39 pm

    Oooh! Will there be Niblets and counter-Niblets?

  105. July 8, 2009 at 4:42 pm

    I had commented at Keepapichinin (a site I visited yesterday for the first time and read today for the first time) before this came up in the comments. Now someone there is attacking me for making it look like I was now, at the last minute, trying to become a part of the community.

    Will all my comments in the nacle be questioned from this point forth – or just until the end of this business?


  106. July 8, 2009 at 4:42 pm

    Christopher, Andrew, you are both missing your chance to get some Evil Villian points. Quick, one of you, say something about gay marriage to kick the flamewar up another notch!

  107. Ray
    July 8, 2009 at 4:42 pm

    No, Scott. In the only sense that matters in this context, “to cater” means “to be particularly attentive to or solicitous of”. There is a strong implication of special attention and favor. We weren’t paraticularly attentive to or solicitous of anybody; we simply asked for nominations from those who are active in the Bloggernacle and posted those nominations.

    Look, I’m not backing away from our responsibility for the way it was structured. It was our choice. All I’m saying is that we weren’t particularly attentive to or solicitous of anyone. We didn’t “cater” to anyone. There was significant backlash last time when the nomination process was done electorally, so we tried it democratically this time. We will tweak it significantly next time. We’ll try to figure out exactly what the best method is to make it exactly what it should be. Please, just don’t claim we have pissed on and catered to people. We haven’t. That’s all.

    This really is a celebration, and we can continue that celebratory effort without turning it into a fist fight. That’s not what the Bloggernacle should be, either. So, let’s work together to figure it out and make it exactly what it should be.

  108. Ray
    July 8, 2009 at 4:47 pm

    Brother Matsby absolutely is a part of the Bloggernacle. That is one concern with which I disagree totally.

    and, Steve, I already said in #94 I am open to tweaking the awards to reflect the concerns being raised. I have NO problem with that. None, whatsoever.

  109. July 8, 2009 at 4:47 pm

    But we already question all of your comments, Bro. Matsby.

  110. July 8, 2009 at 4:53 pm

    re 103: Steve Evans
    Jul 8th, 2009 at 4:38 pm

    BTW I doubt you’re hosting the Niblets next year.


    Is it too soon for this picture?

    re 106: I know, but most of the people here have probably voted already! Darn that Jack!

  111. Steve Evans
    July 8, 2009 at 4:58 pm

    Not a threat, just a prediction. There’s a reason sites only host the Niblets once.

  112. July 8, 2009 at 5:12 pm

    re 111: an ominous and ambiguous prediction indeed.

  113. July 8, 2009 at 5:14 pm

    What Steve leaves unstated is this:


  114. July 8, 2009 at 5:14 pm

    Andrew 110 – that has to be nominated for a 2009 funniest comment. Steve Evans – is it too early to nominate for 2009? I don’t want to jump the gun here if the nominations will be closed down to just the Mormonati again. 😉

    *calling more aunts and cousins to solicit votes*

  115. Jeff Spector
    July 8, 2009 at 5:25 pm

    Didn’t people get a chance to nominate? Why the complaining now?

    Gees, if only Sunday School could be this exciting.

  116. gst
    July 8, 2009 at 5:28 pm

    Kaimi, Danites if you’re lucky. More likely, Cenobites.

  117. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 5:31 pm

    Steve Evans – “Not a threat, just a prediction. There’s a reason sites only host the Niblets once.” Wait, is this reverse psychology? Because I could do this all day. Really. 😉

  118. July 8, 2009 at 5:32 pm

    Great idea, Jeff. I’ve been wondering how I could contribute to pepping up my ward.
    Think I’ll start a Ward Niblets:

    Best SS lesson 2009
    Coolest Primary teacher
    Best SM talk
    Most delicious Nursery snacks
    Most irrelevant HFPE meeting….

  119. gst
    July 8, 2009 at 5:32 pm

    By the way, this whole process is a travistshamockery, just like in years past. I mean, the only time I won anything I had to share it with Ronan in a tie. Honestly–Ronan!

  120. July 8, 2009 at 5:33 pm

    I just fill like I’ve been p*ssed on and catered to because Valoel is keeping the nominations for funniest reasons to be Mormon open, with NO moderation. Seriously? It leads to comments like Andrew A’s #38.

    / 😉

  121. sister blah 2
    July 8, 2009 at 5:36 pm

    I feel sad that kevinf has only 2 votes–c’mon people!

  122. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 5:37 pm

    AdamF – good call

    sister blah 2 – I’m out of IP addresses. Maybe if we go to the public library . . .

  123. July 8, 2009 at 5:39 pm

    Not a threat, just a prediction. There’s a reason sites only host the Niblets once.

    I feel a great disturbance in the force. It’s as if thousands of voices cried out and were suddenly silent. Either that or my lunch at Taco Bell was ill advised.

  124. July 8, 2009 at 5:44 pm

    at this stage, I’m unsure if we’ve pissed on Steve Evans and friends or if they merely are pissed off.

  125. Thomas Parkin
    July 8, 2009 at 5:46 pm

    BiV, #118 is a great illustration of why the Niblets might not be such a great idea.
    I’m actually torn.

    I’m flattered that Ray, of all Naccle figures, would nominate me, and actually quite satisfied that 4 people would vote for me. I’m just not sure that either thing will improve my contribution. Do I do more to curry favor. What? It makes me conscious of a thing that perhaps I’d do better not conscious of.

    Also, while gst might have a quicker wit than me, I can be way stranger than he is. You have no idea. Waaaay stranger. No one must know how much I tone it down. If there was a category for strangest contributor, and I took the gloves off … oh, baby, an ocean of strange like you wouldn’t believe. ~

  126. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 5:49 pm

    Andrew S. – have some more popcorn

  127. July 8, 2009 at 5:52 pm

    buttery popped corn kernels definitely taste better in the mouth than foot.

  128. July 8, 2009 at 5:54 pm

    I actually tried voting at my public library, and…

  129. July 8, 2009 at 5:56 pm

    Good idea, Hawk girl, let me go grab some off of the apricot tree.

  130. July 8, 2009 at 6:57 pm

    After reading some of the above, it appears that I’ve been neglectful in not (1) demanding that I be added to various categories I wasn’t nominated for, (2) publicly attacking nominees that I have some unclear axe to grind against, (3) publicly attacking a group of people who worked amazingly hard at trying to put this process together in a fair and successful way, and finally (4) commenting in a tone which I would never tolerate in blogs where I’m personally in charge.

    As someone who did not take part in organizing the Niblets, I’m honestly both shocked and dismayed at the public behavior which seems to be taking place above.

  131. July 8, 2009 at 7:14 pm

    You mean I can vote more than once?!

    Why does this always happen? I’m glad my catastrophe of a life is valued, and I’m glad I’m winning… I haven’t put up a link, so it’s doubly cool whoever is voting for me.

    Also, I am Steve Evans’ friend. I am neither p*ssed off, nor have I been p*ssed on. But I am his friend. Just for the record.

    Thanks guys, again, for doing this thankless task.

  132. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 7:17 pm

    I hope we are all Steve Evans’ friends! And Ardis’ and Tracy’s and . . .

  133. July 8, 2009 at 7:18 pm

    Woa, this conversation took on a life of its own since I last left it. I stand by everything I said earlier.

    Oh, and why this wasn’t an issue during the nominations? If you posted that after comment 101, go back and read 101. Also, I too thought that it was kind of odd that every entry was getting nominated. At the time it seemed a clear joke that something like TAMN would garner significant amounts of votes for a category such as Best overall blogger. I suspect that’s part of why no one brought it up back then. That’s my reason. But I was wrong and those of us thinking that should have spoken up. And so, when some of us saw within a few hours on Tuesday afternoon that TAMN-related nominations suddenly shot up and overtook other entries, there just seemed like something was wrong. Thus, we speak now.

    I’m encouraged by Ray’s talk of adjusting things, but I can’t see how that wouldn’t actually make things even more asterisked than they already appear.

    There’s always next year I guess. I wish good luck to those who are playing by the rules. To the rest, well…

  134. July 8, 2009 at 7:26 pm

    Jared writes:

    “Oh, and why this wasn’t an issue during the nominations? If you posted that after comment 101, go back and read 101.”

    I’m the one who said that this issue should have been raised during nominations (98), and comment 101 posted a few minutes later, explicitly directed as a reply to my comment.

    So, no, I didn’t post my comment after the reply-to-it was posted in 101; that would require powers over the space-time continuum which I don’t quite have. (Yet.)

  135. Jared T.
    July 8, 2009 at 7:34 pm

    Kaimi, I realized that and I wasn’t referring to you, nor faulting you for asking the question. Thanks.

  136. July 8, 2009 at 7:40 pm

    I like everyone.

  137. Anonymous
    July 8, 2009 at 8:18 pm

    Just some thoughts: Ya couldn’t expect a nomination of a blogpost about…eg Twilight to compete with one about eg some historians’ conference, right? The difference is akin to that between the Oscars and the People’s Choice Awards (if there’s one called that). Suggested fix? Count ballots only from recognized Bloggernaclites. If a category gets a lot of votes from non-Bloggernaclites, perhaps recognize it with a special “popular category” award of some kind.

  138. July 8, 2009 at 9:25 pm

    Did someone say something about Danites?

  139. July 8, 2009 at 9:49 pm

    Folks, I think that Hawkgrrl and Batman and the rest of the Justice League of America here have done as good of a job as could be expected to be flexible. They split categories as suggested in nominations, added categories (Best Prop 8, Best Evil Villian), and took every reasonable step to set up a vote that reflected people’s suggestions and ideas. There were 200 comments in the two nominations posts, and *no one mentioned this then.*

    Thanks for that.

    The kind of negative feedback and hostility that descends on those who host the Niblets is the reason few have the stomach to do them two years in a row. However, I’ll bet Hawkgrrl will be up to it next year 😉

  140. July 8, 2009 at 9:58 pm

    98: It’s uncool and invites ridicule to give the slightest indication that you take the Niblets seriously in any way — yet if we don’t at least give a good natured pretense of taking them seriously, what’s the point in having them?

    But making suggestions or noting inconsistencies, no matter how diplomatically done, invites charges of sour grapes, going postal, foot-in-mouth disease, and multiple comments from those who are bringing out the popcorn and settling in for the fireworks. That’s my reason for not raising any caution flags in the abruptly terminated nomination phase. Rather than speaking up to be mocked, I hoped elections would be fair and be a fun way of acknowledging efforts of people I like quite well. It was only when I saw the work of good Bloggernaclers being slighted by incomprehensible vote counts in favor of blogs and bloggers who have played no role whatsoever in the Bloggernacle as I know it, that I spoke up.

    Accusations that my comments are sour grapes are patently ridiculous. Keepa is doing embarrassingly well in categories I never thought of making a showing in. Ironically, the “best new blog” category, which is the only one I expected to be nominated for, is the only one where I’m struggling. So obviously it isn’t on my own behalf that I’m crying foul.

    I had been disappointed that the Niblets hadn’t shown up months ago — after all, this was the only year when Keepa would be eligible for best new blog — and I appreciate the efforts of those who are hosting them now. I cheerfully posted the material BiV sent to me, I voted, and I’ve taken an interest in how things are developing. I don’t know what more I could have done to support the whole game. Still, it is only just to point out that there are problems. I wish kibbitzers wouldn’t jeer when I do so.

  141. July 8, 2009 at 9:59 pm

    re 137:

    Irony is a proposition for selectivism and elitism written by someone who wishes to be Anonymous. Not saying this isn’t something we could consider in the future, but based on your criteria, wouldn’t we have to discard your idea, dear Anon?

  142. Jeff Spector
    July 8, 2009 at 10:05 pm


    “Think I’ll start a Ward Niblets:”

    Too funny. I might try something like that on Sunday during my SS lesson…..

  143. Hawkgrrrl
    July 8, 2009 at 10:20 pm

    Ardis #140 – “multiple comments from those who are bringing out the popcorn and settling in for the fireworks.” Well, not exactly in Andrew S.’s defense, but there is a reason he’s up for nicest evil villain. :0 Also, he cracks out that popcorn for the most minor of kerfuffles and dust-ups, including some that are imaginary. Right, Andrew S.?

  144. July 8, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    re 140:

    Ardis, I would hope that if I could express one thing, it is that popcorn is delicious, a kernel of peace for the nations.

    …In fact, we have *always* and will always welcome suggestions and comments. We aren’t deleting or silencing or ignoring or dismissing. In fact, when there were a few slip-ups at the beginning of the process, we worked to address them promptly.

    We are paying attention to the suggestions throughout this process and will look forward to some more at its conclusion. It’s not like we’ve been doing this for years, after all.

    I think the thing is…we want to at least get through our first Niblets without people crying foul who have never said a single thing before now. We want to at least get through our first Niblets without people wanting to change every single detail because of certain nominations that have gone through that no one had vocalized any concern about before (perhaps because they assumed we had been doing this for years and so they felt they could predict how we would handle it.) This doesn’t mean that we want to get through our first Niblets in total silence, because that is not our goal and was never our goal.

  145. Ed
    July 8, 2009 at 10:52 pm

    What a bunch of whining pansies some of these T&S folks are coming off as (Kaimi excluded of course). Wow, talk about an entitlement complex. Talk about trying to shut people out and maintain their tired, lame exclusive little cliques and lord over their insignificant fiefdoms.

    The fact that they bristle at a democratic selection process and favor “vetting”, presumably by only an elite cadre of REAL Bloggernacle members like THEMSELVES, so that they can exercise control over the process and bring more credit to themselves, closely resembles the Hollywood hacks who prefer the secret, back room selection process for Oscar nominations rather than an open selection process guided by the voice of the people.

    Steve and others who are whining about the selection process, get a clue. You don’t own the Bloggernacle concept. You don’t define it. And it doesn’t even have a fixed definition, so it’s silly to throw a temper tantrum about it. “I doubt you’ll be hosting the Niblets next year.” Get over yourselves already. If people didn’t consider the Bloggernacle to include Seriously So Blessed or TAMN (or whoever else you want to exclude) they wouldn’t vote for it/her/them. The very fact that so many people ARE voting for SSB and others shows that they DO in fact consider them part of the Bloggernacle whether you like it or not, and whether you agree with it or not. And your failure to value public opinion indicates perhaps that you are out of touch with the unwashed masses whose equally-valid opinions you wish to exclude, suppress, and discount.

    (And might also explain why T&S is trailing so far behind in the voting . . .)

  146. July 8, 2009 at 11:30 pm

    Thanks for hosting the Niblets this year, Superfriends.

    If I were you I wouldn’t worry too much about the vengeful Danithites or the roving bands of trained attack internet-comedians.

    As a little girl in Ghana once told me (the Sprint operator) while playing with the pay-phone, so say I to you: “I just called to tell you you’re doing a great job!”

  147. July 8, 2009 at 11:36 pm


    Har! Yeah blame all of those T&S permabloggers who have been commenting here. Except Kaimi of course. But blame the other T&S losers like, ummm… (who did you have in mind from T&S again Ed?)


  148. July 8, 2009 at 11:58 pm

    If anyone here thinks I am their enemy, they are wrong.

  149. July 9, 2009 at 12:08 am

    Ed, I think you haven’t really been paying attention to what has been said. I don’t think anyone’s advocating the type of either-or you seem to think. What I’m seeing is people talking about a better mix between public nomination, clearer criteria for nomination, and responsible vetting. That sounds pretty reasonable. I think that pretty much everyone who’s expressed these thoughts has done so with recognition of the immense effort this is and with appreciation for that. If it hasn’t been clear in what I personally have written, then I’m sorry it hasn’t and want to recognize it. At the same time, 144, like so many things, sometimes you don’t see how things will play out until the wheels are in motion. Now that the wheels are turning, I think it’s the best time to point out where the perceived squeaks are.

    Ditto to #145. You may want to reconsider your dig at T&S, Ed.

    I guess all of this is what I get for taking this whole thing seriously. Thanks for the memories. I think I’m done with this thread. But by all means, come visit me at the Juvenile Instructor. I’m getting ready to put up a short review of the latest Utah Historical Quarterly and coblogger Ed has a great post right now about the history of the term “Happy Valley”. Well worth a look.

  150. July 9, 2009 at 12:19 am

    re 145:

    yeah, like Geoff said.

    As per Steve Evans’s site…well, this one is kicking even the Feminists’, yea, even the Mommies’ site butts.

  151. brjones
    July 9, 2009 at 12:42 am

    Um, you guys do realize that these are like, pretend awards, with no real objective value, right? Is anyone here familiar with the scene in the movie “Can’t Hardly Wait” where the two, ahem, Star Wars enthusiasts, are having a heated argument on the roof of the pool house about what Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader would or wouldn’t do in a certain hypothetical situation? Reading the comments to this post I’m getting a flashback.

    Honestly, the idea that anyone spends enough time online to have a sufficient knowledge of all the different blogs and individuals listed above is pretty incomprehensible to me. I only frequent one of these blogs, and it already takes up too much of my time. The rivalries between the respective blogs seems a bit odd to me.

    That said, putting together the nominations and setting up the voting was obviously a lot of work, so kudos to Batman. A lot of people obviously enjoy it.

  152. July 9, 2009 at 1:06 am

    re 151: but brjones, don’t you see.

    nihilism isn’t complete without existentialism. Regardless of the objective meaninglessness of the awards, what’s important is that people subjectively project meaning onto them.

  153. July 9, 2009 at 1:16 am

    Mandatory nihilism follow up:

    Nihilists!? [Oh, darn.] I mean, say what you like about the tenets of National Socialism, Dude, at least it’s an ethos.


  154. brjones
    July 9, 2009 at 2:07 am

    For your information, the Supreme Court has roundly rejected prior restraint. I’m staying Dude. I’m finishing my coffee.

  155. Anonymous
    July 9, 2009 at 4:53 am

    Andrew S.: oops (… embarrassedly I must admit I’m actually not a Bloggernaclite myself)

  156. Ronan
    July 9, 2009 at 6:14 am

    Back in my day, the Niblets were a lot saner.

  157. Ray
    July 9, 2009 at 7:09 am

    That’s because you were a lot saner than we are, Ronan.

  158. Randy B.
    July 9, 2009 at 7:38 am

    The best part about the Niblets each year is the inevitable navel-gazing and bone-picking that ensues. This year did not disappoint. Kudos to MM for hosting!

    I voted for SSB in three categories, all of which I believe are richly deserved. I tend to agree that including Tamn’s “Tamners Goes to Washington” in “best current event post” is a category mistake, but the notion that SSB should have been bounced out of the polls, despite multiple nominations from long-time ‘nacclites, just strikes me as silly, even comical. At this point, SSB has as many votes for “best big blog” as MM, T&S, and M* combined. In the “best solo blog” category, SSB is currently in third, with nearly 3 times the number of votes of the next closest nominee (Life on Gold Plates). And in the crowded “best new blog,” SSB is again running in third, beating out 11 other blogs.

    Like it or not, the people voting here think SSB is not just part of the bloggernacle but one of the best parts. Count me among them.

  159. July 9, 2009 at 9:06 am

    Ed, the only T&S permablogger who has commented in this thread is Kaimi. Ardis runs her own solo blog — while she does cross-post at T&S from time to time, she is no longer part of the Great T&S Conspiracy (which basically means she’s not on our email backlist). And why is it that everyone complains about T&S when they have a Bloggernacle beef? Why not complain about BCC or FMH or Mormon Matters or even Seriously So Blessed?

    Thanks to Mormon Matters for hosting the 2008 Niblets (a thankless task). It’s not an election, folks. It’s more like an online poll (i.e., largely meaningless). But it does serve the useful function of highlighting blogs, posts, and bloggers that some of us weren’t aware of before.

  160. Darryl
    July 9, 2009 at 9:32 am

    Good grief. I’m late in reading through all these comments, but after doing so, is it too late to write-in nominate Steve Evans as “Whiniest Little [female dog]”?


    Sounds like my two-year old having a tantrum. I would think that if Steve truly wanted something to be fixed, it would be the removal of his pathetic, egotistical, exclusivist, whiney complaints from this thread.

  161. July 9, 2009 at 9:54 am

    Randy: Like it or not, the people voting here think SSB is not just part of the bloggernacle but one of the best parts.

    Doubt it. Rather, it is a popular non-Bloggernacle blog and my guess is that non bloggernaclites who know abso-freakin-lutely nothing about the bloggernacle (like that moron Ed in #145) see it on the list and vote for it.

  162. July 9, 2009 at 10:33 am

    In the future I’m going to hold a by invitation only Niblets. In order to nominate someone or vote you’ll have to have been a top 20 commenter on Banner of Heaven. The cast of Banner of Heaven will have veto power over any nominations. And then I won’t announce the results publicly.

  163. July 9, 2009 at 10:36 am

    And while I’m at it, let me just say that in no way shape or form is SSB a bloggernacle blog. If it is, then all the crap blogs that the people in my ward produce (which taken as a whole are more outrageous and funnier than SSB) are all bloggernacle blogs and those people have never heard of the bloggernacle.

  164. MaryAA
    July 9, 2009 at 10:44 am

    Had to vote for Russell Arben Fox’s comment on co-dependency seeing as how I was the co-dependent he was replying too.

    I like the Niblets in that in points me to comments/posts/blogs that I may have missed.

  165. July 9, 2009 at 10:50 am

    Furthermore, many thanks to MM for performing what is inevitably a thankless task, and doing a reasonably good job of it as well.

  166. July 9, 2009 at 10:55 am

    Yeah, a few tweaks in the nominations process aside, I think MM has done a great job here. It’s a great service to the bloggernacle because it builds community. It also builds awareness. I’ve had a great time discovering posts and blogs I hadn’t been aware of or had missed. Thanks much, folks.

  167. July 9, 2009 at 11:06 am

    I think that Seriously so blessed is performing so well because it is seriously so blessed and everyone is persecutin.

    persecuters gon persecute.

  168. July 9, 2009 at 11:18 am

    They’re drinking hater-ade.

  169. Anonymous
    July 9, 2009 at 12:08 pm

    Would Tamn have the same sentiments she applies to spelling nazis [she writes, “I’m not a namecaller but anyone who seriously cares is kinda a looser”] — toward the RUUUDE!!headedness of Nacle elites?

  170. July 9, 2009 at 12:39 pm


    I have those sorts of sentiments towards anonymous commenters…

  171. July 9, 2009 at 2:48 pm

    Bad news, folks. Bored in Vernal has been disqualified:

  172. Randy B.
    July 9, 2009 at 3:06 pm

    Don’t know why that would be a disqualifier. Gotta be par for the course with all those crazy apostates at BCC.

  173. July 9, 2009 at 3:30 pm

    Well, then the bad news is she won’t be available for comment after the voting is over.

  174. July 9, 2009 at 3:59 pm

    For shame, you should know that pacifist Bored in Vernal doesn’t tote guns!!
    And I’m a strict WoW follower, too. Mistaken identity. I’m still accepting votes.

  175. July 9, 2009 at 4:07 pm

    Don’t believe her.

  176. July 9, 2009 at 4:15 pm

    If BCC are apostates, then I’m the prince of darkness herself.

  177. Randy B.
    July 9, 2009 at 4:23 pm

    So let it be written, so let it be done.

  178. Ray
    July 9, 2009 at 4:26 pm

    Yeah, Andrew, I had that thought, but I didn’t want to say anything publicly. 🙂

    Actually, I reserve that title for at least one of the nominees in the evil villian category – and wonder how in the world he got nominated as nicest one.

  179. July 9, 2009 at 4:42 pm

    I love John Hamer.

    (John Dehlin as Batman for a comment)

  180. Hawkgrrrl
    July 9, 2009 at 4:43 pm

    I too heart John Hamer!

  181. July 9, 2009 at 4:48 pm

    …AND Ronan. Can’t forget Ronan.

    (John again)

  182. July 9, 2009 at 5:53 pm

    When did BiV become one of teh chosen at BCC?

    I heart John Hamer too. But he already knows that.

    And the _edit_ feature? PURE genius, MM people!

  183. Rigel Hawthorne
    July 9, 2009 at 6:04 pm

    Clever Bhodges. Best laugh I’ve had all day.

  184. July 9, 2009 at 6:15 pm

    John is Batman?

  185. July 9, 2009 at 6:41 pm

    speaking which, I am now officially viewed as the meanest evil villain (or, turning that frown upside down, the least evil villain)

  186. July 9, 2009 at 6:44 pm

    I nominate TAMN for best “Who the hell are you” blog.

  187. Hawkgrrrl
    July 9, 2009 at 7:09 pm

    Kaimi – “John is Batman?” As in the beginning of “The Dark Knight,” there are many who don the rubber suit here at MM. That’s why there’s a mask, silly.

  188. July 9, 2009 at 8:32 pm

    Um, you guys do realize that these are like, pretend awards, with no real objective value, right?

    Of course …

    Now that I’ve looked at SSB, I won’t ever get those brain cells back …

  189. Anonymous
    July 9, 2009 at 9:31 pm

    Stephen, Tamn is the Bloggernacle’s (or, rather, Mormon blogosphere’s) “Borat”

  190. July 9, 2009 at 9:47 pm

    No she’s not.

  191. anonymous
    July 9, 2009 at 9:50 pm

    Anonymous, more like the “Mormon Blogosphere’s” Helen Fielding.

  192. July 9, 2009 at 10:04 pm

    Or how about the “Mormon Blogosphere’s” Gallagher?

  193. Rach
    July 9, 2009 at 10:05 pm

    Okay. Please, please, someone close the comments. I’ve laughed hard enough today. These are fake awards. Stop bashing other blogs. Stop with the overanalysis. My tummy hurts.

  194. July 9, 2009 at 10:20 pm

    not until we get to 800+, Rach!


  195. July 9, 2009 at 10:27 pm

    Our Borat sucks.

  196. JJWT
    July 10, 2009 at 8:10 am

    All you haters seriously need to chill. If my wife is insufficiently bloggernacle-y, she wouldn’t have been nominated.

    I could totally beat you guys up. But I won’t. I’ll just be your boss when I finish law/medical/dental/business school.

  197. Wikipedia
    July 10, 2009 at 8:32 am

    JJWT, welcome to MM. Speaking of “The handiest and the dandiest kitchen tool you’ve ever seen, and don’t ya wanna know how it works! First you take an ordinary apple! You place the apple between the patented pans! Then you reach for the tool that is not a slicer, not a dicer, not a chopper in a hopper! What in the hell can it possibly be?” (Sells lotsa tix but ends up listed as only number one hundred (after Janeane Garofalo) on Comedy Central’s hundred greatest stand-ups of all time? Harumph. Gallagher said when reading it he “was trying to find anyone I ever heard of.”)

  198. Anonymous/Justmeherenow
    July 10, 2009 at 9:20 am

    Some hints wrt Tamn’s identity (who maybe doesn’t even need a Niblet on her mantle next to her big ol stack o’ checks fo ad revenue/teeshirt sales?) as gathered by KSL’s Candice Madsen:

    She revealed a few facts, saying, “I am a relatively new mom and in grad school. I do love Café Rio, and I’m trying to get off Diet Coke a lot of the time.” She’s also 25 and a returned missionary, but that’s as much as she wants to reveal. She’s having too much fun with her anonymity. Her own friends don’t know about her alter-ego. “I’ve gotten some hate E-mails[…]. The comments, as most readers will tell you, are basically the best part. My readers are hilarious. It’s kind of a little community.”

    Geez, her commenters write the funny stuff and she cashes the checks!

  199. anonymous
    July 10, 2009 at 9:27 am

    #198, JJWT is in sells, so course they know how to make money. You should of read ssb before. Then you’d know that TAMN is too modest to claim that her blog is funny. She prolly doesn’t know about the bloogernacle at all. But she does know that everyone is jelous of her.

  200. Ray
    July 10, 2009 at 11:08 am

    OK, I’m taking out my “play nice, kids” paddle.

  201. Rach
    July 10, 2009 at 11:13 am

    Okay, we get it. You don’t like TAMN’s blog. She didn’t nominate herself. Are you done?

  202. Ray
    July 10, 2009 at 11:19 am

    BTW, that paddle is for both sides – as those who know me understand. 🙂

  203. July 10, 2009 at 12:22 pm

    How did annoyance get changed into jealousy?

  204. July 10, 2009 at 12:44 pm

    The be-nice paddle, Ray? Ooh! Spank me! And me! And me! You must give us all a good spanking. B)

    So, this has been an interesting discussion. The complaining on both sides has been over the top and silly. Steve says stupid sh* sometimes. The counter-arguments get silly too, sometimes, dredging up overblown old anti-elitist rhetoric. And the heat-to-light ratio in that thread is way, way too high. Half of the vents don’t even make sense. The awesomely misguided anti-T&S rant takes the cake. (I’m the only T&S perma who has commented here, folks.)

    At the end of the day, it seems like there are a lot of things going on:

    1. MM did a lot of work putting this together. Kudos to them for their work. This does create some pride in ownership at MM, and folks here will be sensitive to criticisms of the process. (Though you’re shown admirable restraint.)

    2. A lot of people put a lot of time into the bloggernacle community. The community is loosely defined, but it *is* still generally defined in the same rough way by most people. The people who put time into the community get some pride from being recognized.

    3. This is, in some ways, like a closed primary. When you open it up, you get votes from people who aren’t invested in the political party. Bringing outsiders in to vote can cause upset and hurt feelings, because readers of SSB may be one-issue voters who may not have any idea what the bloggernacle is. It’s understandable to want to get a vote from people who are invested in the community. (And at least some bloggernacle insiders also engaged in general campaigning which probably brought in more than just regular bloggernacle readers.)

    4. And, no one brought up the closed- versus open-primary issues earlier, when it would have been easier to fix them.

    At this point, the genie is out of the bottle, and it’s too late to change anything. Steve’s intemperate rants won’t change that, and are probably counterproductive; overreactions to Steve’s rants are also counterproductive.

    Hmm, does that cover everything? 😎

  205. Anonymous/Justmeherenow
    July 10, 2009 at 12:48 pm

    Context: Jealous is the way (the beautiful and righteous) Tamn (on her faux blog) characterizes snipers.

  206. July 10, 2009 at 12:50 pm

    So Kaimi, is that a meta-reaction to Steve? 😉

  207. anonymous
    July 10, 2009 at 1:39 pm

    Just pointing out, in response to Kaimi’s post, that there is still no link or advertising of the Niblets at seriouslysoblessed, so presumably most of the votes for ssb are coming from Bloggernaclites. So, it does still seem to be something of a closed primary.

  208. July 10, 2009 at 1:41 pm

    I got a nomination – that’s cool.

    Thank you.

  209. Justmeherenow
    July 10, 2009 at 1:44 pm

    Kaimi, I will bet you (as Governor Palin would say; usually rendered phonetically, unlike, say, were Clinton’s Arkansas-isms) — some bonefide Naclites had voted for SSB, before there was any brouhaha, though, too.
    Suggestions wrt…
    Nominations. Do the Niblets via e-mail list, serving as an equivalent of a “Academy of Bloggernacle Arts and Sciences,” which has authors of blogs listed, say, at Archipelago as automatic members. Mail out the call for nominations to ppl on this master list, supplemented by sending out emails being sent out to all commenters during the last month at the biggest half-dozen or so group blogs. Assign each email sent out a number.
    Actual “Niblets” blog post. People who were not sanctioned voters are asked to mention this fact in their votes. Tally ballots coming in from known individuals separately, and in cases where hosts might be a little unsure of who the voter is, an email is sent asking for the person’s official ballot number. In cases where nominees amass a majority of votes only by inclusion of non-“qualified” ballots, give would-be winners special recognition but not actual Niblets.

  210. Justmeherenow
    July 11, 2009 at 9:13 am

    (To fill out the Borat analogy a little: SSB works, mostly (IMO) cos of its juxtaposition of Tamn’s sweetness with the un-self-aware bafoonery of those outraged by her.)

  211. Anonymous
    July 12, 2009 at 3:31 pm
  212. chuckles
    July 13, 2009 at 10:06 am

    Look at you all–seeking the praises of men. Aren’t you cute.

  213. July 14, 2009 at 9:42 am

    Thanks, Ray, for Segullah’s nomination. It’s an honor.

    When exactly do the polls close?

  214. July 14, 2009 at 1:48 pm

    This thread has been like watching my mommy and daddy fight. I adore SSB. Absolutely adore it, partly because I am surrounded by (and related to) real life TAMN’s, and reading that blog gives me hope that I’m not the only one in the world sick of the faux-righteousness and narrow minded certainty those women live their lives with.

    But I also adore the bloggernacle, and honestly, until this moment I didn’t even realize that it was anymore strictly defined than “a collection of Mormon blogs” which SSB and Dooce and CJane would all certainly fit into. I think there have been some great suggestions made for further definition which would solve a lot of the problem.

    I guess I just don’t understand the threat SSB and Dooce and CJane pose to the “True” Bloggernacle blogs. They’re not trying to offer the same things, what they are offering are spectacular sometimes and never something that’s “bad”, and they are a part of the larger Mormon internet community. When I read the category title “Best Individual Blogger” I only thought which blogger had the posts I thought were the best, whether that was on an individual blog or a group blog. After reading the thread, I really like Ardis’ thought that the blogger’s participation in the community should be taken into consideration, but that was never included in the rules, so as for this go round that perspective is no more or less valid then me liking TAMN despite her blog not trying to establish community.

    I also don’t really understand the philosophical difference with blogs that run ads, but I suppose that’s another discussion for another day.

  215. July 14, 2009 at 1:59 pm

    I think the participation in the community is a good standard for next time. Regarding ads, there may be more reasons, but it seems like jealousy to me. We don’t want to compete with people who are getting paid for doing this stuff! 😉

  216. July 14, 2009 at 3:30 pm

    Reese, those blogs are not a threat to the bloggernacle, but the bulk of their readers are not the same people as the bulk of the readers for the bloggernacle blogs — their overwhelming numbers prove that. Pitting SSB against almost any of the bloggernacle blogs is like pitting cotton candy against a full Thanksgiving dinner. Maybe everybody who voted for it thought “Tamners goes to Washington” the most hilarious, insightful parody they had ever read anywhere, but it is utterly worthless in comparison to any of the competing posts, which required time to attend the events, careful notetaking, thoughtful drafting, and everything else that SSB is not. But there are a lot of people who like cotton candy, especially when they’ve never participated in Thanksgiving dinner and so can’t recognize the difference.

  217. July 14, 2009 at 3:54 pm

    I definitely agree that your work and all the others who pour hours of research and scholarship into their blogs should be recognized. And by this point in the discussion I think it’s clear that we all agree there have been some lessons learned and that the categories ended up being more broad than anyone recognized. I just hate to see these other blogs so denigrated.

    What SSB does, it does well. It’s not trying to be Thanksgiving dinner, and as great as Thanksgiving dinner can be, I don’t want it for every meal. These blogs do have value.

    What I take away is that some people aren’t satisfied with how the categories ended up working out, and that is fine, but that doesn’t need to translate into trashing or dismissal of every blog that isn’t a scholarly journal.

  218. July 14, 2009 at 4:14 pm

    translate into trashing or dismissal of every blog that isn’t a scholarly journal

    That’s an entirely unfair characterization of anything I’ve said, or anything I can remember being said by others who have noted problems. It’s comments like that, that make the Niblets a trainwreck — I know my replying is tantamount to staring at the gore, but I can’t tear my eyes away. Every time I think this can’t get worse, it does.

  219. July 14, 2009 at 4:41 pm

    No no Ardis, please don’t mistake me. I don’t mean to tromp on nerves here. I wasn’t trying to say that every objection raised is wrong, or that you specifically said anything I particularly disagreed with. That comment was not directed to you personally but to the people who were creating what I saw as an issue I wanted to address, which is company I was not mentally including you in. Throughout the long life of this thread there absolutely has been some harsh things said about SSB and others and I was attempting to distinguish that *that’s* what I was concerned about. Not about raising any objections at all. And I certainly don’t disagree that ideally SSB should not be competing in the same category as a scholarly journal. I’m just trying to argue that since there is not a specific category for a humor blog, SSB finds itself competing with blogs it doesn’t have a lot in common with, and that does not automatically make SSB unworthy or of no value. It’s just different.

    I think that your comment about a different readership is totally valid, and as I mentioned I think a lot of other people had a lot of other great ideas that would help resolve some of the concerns others expressed. I’m just trying to come to the defense of some blogs who are being criticized for just being what they are.

  220. Andrew Ainsworth
    July 14, 2009 at 5:18 pm

    I ran into an old friend at church the other day and he brought up how silly all this griping about the Niblets has been. Let’s get some perspective here:

    Of the 13 million Mormons, the number of Mormons who regularly frequent LDS-themed blogs probably ranges between 5,000 – 10,000.

    Of that number, less than 800 have even voted in the Niblets process. The winner of most categories will have won by receiving only about 100 votes, maybe even less, which makes the significance of a Niblets “win” in just about any category tantamount to being elected president of your junior high, or maybe a junior high club.

    So when it comes to big fish in a little pond, we are dealing with a very, very, very small pond indeed.

    So why do Niblets at all? This whole thing is meant for fun and camaraderie, it’s not for fame and glory, and it’s a shame if folks can’t recognize that.

    If anyone blogs for the purpose of getting credit for their “time to attend the events, careful notetaking, thoughtful drafting,” and yadda yadda, they should probably take up journalism or at least a more serious endeavor. I struggle to understand how anyone could be so attached to the expectation of getting “credit” and “recognition” for engaging in a hobby, provided gratuitously to the public, that they would turn an occasion for fun and camaraderie into an occasion filled with griping, bickering, cliquish/exclusionary behavior, denigrating others’ work and blogs, and general weeping, wailing, and gnashing of teeth.

    If there’s one thing I’ve learned from all this, some people take their blogging really, really, really, really, really seriously. So seriously that they’re willing to be insulting and dismissive and rude to others if they don’t get the “credit” and “recognition” they think they deserve . . . for a hobby . . . offered to the public gratuitously . . . only read by about 5,000 – 10,000 people tops . . . less than 800 of which even care enough to vote . . . with most winners getting around only 100 votes or less.

    Are we back in junior high again?

  221. July 14, 2009 at 5:48 pm

    You, Andrew Ainsworth, and your analytical skills — if that’s what you were applying to my comment — are most definitely stuck somewhere in junior high.

  222. Andrew Ainsworth
    July 14, 2009 at 7:31 pm

    Ardis, ironically enough, I don’t think your last comment will persuade many readers that my comment above (220) was off-base.

    I’m signing off now. After loosely monitoring this thread I came into the discussion late, and I’m not really interested in getting involved in a junior high-style debate over something so petty.

    I’m sorry this attempted exercise at fun and camaraderie, i.e., the Niblets, didn’t fulfill that purpose for some. Best of luck to you in the future.

  223. July 14, 2009 at 7:33 pm

    Wait wait, Ardis, you were being sarcastic, correct?

    I have enjoyed it. There has to be some kind of balance between caring enough to participate, but not caring so much that anyone gets their underwear twisted up over it.

  224. Sparky
    July 14, 2009 at 8:10 pm

    Oh, sure, pick on the defenseless air-filled sugary confection. A friend of mine alerted me to this site and the disparaging comments that are being made. It’s shameful!

    You may think cotton candy an easy target, what with its’ soft texture and friendly colors, but No! I submit the following list of reasons why you, too, should prefer cotton candy over a thanksgiving dinner:

    – It’s an American institution, invented in 1897 in Tennessee and sold by the truckload!
    – It is associated with happy childhood memories of exploiting vertically challenged people for entertainment, as opposed to celebrating the first steps in the conquest of a continent.
    – There are LESS CALORIES in a serving of cotton candy than there are in that Thanksgiving dinner. Seriously.
    – Clean-up of a Thanksgiving dinner makes mothers everywhere resent the entire event, whereas clean-up of cotton candy is easily achieved with a simple garden hose and a pair of earplugs.
    – After eating Cotton Candy, you never see people moping around, dreading that 4:00 AM madness at Wal-Mart the following day.
    – It is humane, there are NO animals killed during the production of cotton candy!
    – 7 out of 10 Turkeys prefer the taste of cotton candy to… wait, my numbers are off. TEN out of TEN turkeys prefer the taste of cotton candy!

    Cotton Candy is a year-round, enjoyable treat. It isn’t that heavy, burdensome meal that only comes around once each year. (It only comes once a year FOR A GOOD REASON.)

    In short, cotton candy is more humane, better tasting, easier to produce, easier to eat, and just plain more fun.

    I hope that next year the Niblets include a nomination for Cotton Candy. Better yet, ditch the Niblets. Who wants corn? Winners next year should each receive a sugary treat. The losers will be caned.


    Sparky the Clown

  225. July 14, 2009 at 11:18 pm

    Reese, you’ve made some great points, which I happen to agree with. Mormon Matters, from the beginning, has been all about inclusion, and I would prefer to stand for that principle rather than exclusion. I’ve learned that it takes talent and hard work to create humor on a regular basis and at a high quality as well as other types of writing. If there is improvement to be made here for next year, I think it may be in the refinement of categories. If Mormon bloggers are enjoying cotton candy, we would like to recognize it, but it certainly should be put in a different category and not be pitted against Thanksgiving dinner, to use Ardis’ apt analogy. We’ve all learned a little, I hope you’ve had fun, and had an opportunity to savor the many treats that Mormon blogging offers.

  226. Hawkgrrrl
    July 15, 2009 at 12:13 am

    BiV – well said! I second that emotion.

  227. July 15, 2009 at 10:23 pm

    BiV is out of prison guys.

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